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zeros's picture
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Joined: 2016 Dec 31
DVD Player in OS 9

Hi guys. I have an iMac G3 with CD/DVD broken. I put a HD DVD lector of Xbox 360 by USB (yes you readed well, lol).

When i open apple dvd player, that say. "dvd player close beacuse don't found hardware". Can i donwload another dvd player for OS 9? I searched but i dont found anything. All for X.

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MacTouch's picture
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Joined: 2016 Mar 19

Hola zeros

Sorry for your internal drive. I'm not sure Apple DVD player can recognize your very special external drive like standard drives. You need drivers I think, but I don't know if it really exists for this external drive...

zeros's picture
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Joined: 2016 Dec 31

Dont exists drivers, but i can install games an play it. I can see files of DVD with that external drive. But the apple dvd player don't have option to change drive.

Dont exists another program?

MacTouch's picture
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Joined: 2016 Mar 19

Whichever program u can use, not sure your drive would be supported by it. And this, even if u can use your drive normally... I hope for u that I'm wrong.

MikeTomTom's picture
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Joined: 2009 Dec 7

You should use a patched version of the Apple DVD Player 2.7 here.

I see that you wrote earlier on that page that you do not understand how to use the patch tho'.

So I have added a patched copy of the DVD Player on that page (3rd DL in page). This may be easier for you to set up.

However, there is a good chance that the patched version will still fail (because of the USB part), i.e.; it possibly will only be able to access ATA or SCSI devices, not USB.

If this fails; There is one workaround that I can think of (& requires the patched DVD Player):

If you have enough disk space and are able to at least mount a DVD onto your G3's desktop, you can rip the DVD to an image file using the "Virtual CD/DVD Utility" from here.
- grab the latest version (virtual-cd-dvd-ute-10d3.sit) from that page if you don't have a copy.

This utility can rip movie DVD's to .iso images that are double-clickable to mount. If the .iso image contains movie data, this will also launch the (patched) DVD Player and start playing the movie automatically.

This method works for many DVD titles but not all - modern DVD ripping protection may cause it to fail to create a ripped .iso (but if you find movie DVD .iso images sourced elsewhere, then you can also try those).

Good luck.

MacTouch's picture
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Joined: 2016 Mar 19

Interesting. Thanks for this tutorial, Mike. Wink I hope this will really work for him.

Gary's picture
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Joined: 2011 Jul 21

USB on Mac OS 9 is VERY slow. Too slow to watch a DVD directly. If you copy the DVD contents to your hard drive you can watch the movie that way.

Gary

bertyboy's picture
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Joined: 2009 Jun 14

The Mac OS 9 DVD Player is probably also trying to do a region check, which might be hard with the external USB drive, although the patched player provided might circumvent this.

MikeTomTom's picture
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Joined: 2009 Dec 7

The Mac OS 9 DVD Player is probably also trying to do a region check

One of the installed DVD Player System Extensions does the region checking, not the patched (or unpatched) Player. Having the Player recognizing an external USB drive on his G3 would be the most unlikely & remarkable scenario, not to mention the playback you'd get over USB v1.1 Tongue

This patched Player worked well enough for me over the past few years on a beige G3, but I did have a PCI Rage Pro card pulled from a B/W G3 and a nice ATA Pioneer DVD burner/reader to help it along.

SkyCapt's picture
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Joined: 2017 Jan 11

The (graphics hardware) patch didn't help me. I have MDD2003 that can play OS9 DVD with its original ATI9000 graphics card but not with my better ATI9600 card which is great in OSX. It seems the patch can't help on driverless (in OS9) G5-era graphics.

Garden is mainly about Games, so has anyone seen good games that are played IN the DVD Player? I've seen a 1st - person Golf game, a Harry Potter game, a fun Sinbad game. Wouldn't the original arcade Dragon's Lair be a thing to have, in DVD format ! Maybe I'll put up the Sinbad thing on the DVD Player page, for an example of this type of thing? it's only about 100MB.

Gary's picture
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Joined: 2011 Jul 21

>so has anyone seen good games that are played IN the DVD Player?

This seems counter-intuitive to me. Isn't the DVD player a "Read-Only" app? Meaning you can't interact with it except to start and stop the video.

Gary

MikeTomTom's picture
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@SkyCapt: The DVD Player just enables watching DVD movies in OS 9, it can't be used for playing games. At best it might be able to chapter search through movie content.

Also, while the patched player will work with DVD ROM players on some unsupported Macs, I think driver-less unsupported graphics cards would be a whole new ball park for this application. Kudos for giving it a try tho'.

MikeTomTom's picture
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Maybe I'll put up the Sinbad thing on the DVD Player page, for an example of this type of thing? it's only about 100MB.

Looks like you upped it anyway - I removed this from the DVD Player's page.

It doesn't work with this player as the player doesn't support the basic controls required to play this (& probably any game). The game requires left and right controls of a DVD remote to work. This Player doesn't have these simple controls, its too basic even for this.

Also; The player having no "Open" file menu, does not support playback of (VOB) video files, loose in a folder. It expects only a hardware video player with mounted DVD video.

The work-around (and how I tested this as being an unworkable game in the Player) is to create a DVD .iso from the folder containing the VIDEO_TS folder and make it double-click mountable with the Virtual CD/DVD Utility. This "tricks" the Player into thinking there is a loaded DVD.

Anyhow, it doesn't appear to be usable with the Player - Sinbad's boat is un-steerable in the 1st part of the game, which hangs and well, I gave up at that point... The graphics looked good in it tho' and I suppose it works well in some other player, but as a games player, this DVD Player isn't really suitable.

SkyCapt's picture
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Gary, while you know DVD can't Save a game etc, the DVD Player probably has a little RAM to register "states" and "environmental variables", yielding the complexity of like an Atari VCS which i think they say had 128 bytes of RAM (yes bytes, not kilobytes heh).

Sinbad works in OSX DVD Player. The controls are a little weird, but can be learned. The left and right arrow keys will *step around all the navigadgets, so user cannot 'hammer' on left to go left nor right to go right. Pressing left or right once will select that direction accordingly, but pressing the same key a 2nd time chooses the opposite direction and a 3rd time deselects any choice. A 4th press of the same arrow key is back to acting like a 'normal' choice.

When you say it hangs maybe you picked "Back to DWK" from any of the game menus, this (DWK = DreamWorKs the game's creator in year 2003) this goes to EOF end-of-file just because this file is a ripped portion of what was a larger disc data holding some Disney movie other than Sinbad - I think this game was an extra on a disc other than the Sinbad disc it promotes. Anyway, you have to complete part one to continue and you say you couldn't steer, then the only other choice you had was "DWK" which can yes hang the system probably not a harsh hang but maybe closing or quiting DVD Player is better than choosing DWK.

In sinbad game part 1 of 3, when the left+right arrows show on screen, you can begin entering your choice tho you can change your mind. There's about 2 secs before your choice is 'locked-in', and making no choice sends you either left or right and I don't know how it decides that. In part 2 of 3, making no choice always equals certain death so if you hammer left or right arrow 3x in a row, this chooses inaction and char dies and seems like nav is bad, but it is behaving predictably. Game parts 1-3 are arranged hard, medium, simple difficulty in that order (author oughta've made it easy -> med -> hard ya know). In part 2 all you have to do is move & wait, and if you fail to act or can't act because you moved against a wall, thats how you lose. Game part 3 of 3 is so easy I couldn't fail, it won't allow me to shoot and miss nor run out of time.

Sorry that garden didn't like the offering, it is admittedly a fringe type of thing, but I thought like, the best example ever of such a banal type of thing (most DVD "games" are beyond Clunky, they make Flash look good Steve). Anyway my copy survives... and although I haven't looked at it since like 2014 when I first ripped it, it still supplied me with a bit of fun reviewing it again just now...

-----

OSX Tiger is a better DVD Player software than anything before, and imo later player software like Leopard started a downhill trend, Tiger rulez. Since I've got one of the best Mac models ever made, MDD2003 and overclocked CPU overclocked RAM and SSDs able to do 90 (solo) and 125 (Raid) MB/sec - my Tiger DVD Player goes off the hook, like get this: if I pause (a DVD movie), and then hold Right Arrow on lesser hardware this is Slow Motion but on my rig this plays faster than 1x. It's honestly dishing out sequential frames as fast as it can and in being >1x reallife, it is barfing out more than 30 up to 40 real frames per second independent of how a monitor shows it.

Although I switch AGP cards as little as possible, I have tried ATI9000 + OS9 DVD Player with the overclocking, and am astonished how bad it (still) is. On my superhero hardware, it's almost no better than all those years ago when DVD and OS9 were new things and CPU hardware was 266 to 350 MHz. The Garden's OS9 Player 2.7 app page says (at top) it is a "software only" DVD playback but I'm sure this isn't the case, the OS9 DVD Player relies heavily on GPU assist and tho many of us have CPU hardware that can trounce DVD (because DVD never evolved beyond its initial system requirements of year 1997), but the OS9 player has no work around for missing assist graphics hardware. The patch we're discussing looks like it activates some GPUs of_that_era which were initially not allowed, but patch can't initiate any "software only" mode in OS9. OSX gets even more confusing re is the DVD software-only or not. I forgot OS9 couldn't even load a TS (title set) folder from finder, without converting to virtual disc like you did. It felt like previous posts in this thread had recommended play-from-hdd in generic sense.

MikeTomTom's picture
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Gary, while you know DVD can't Save a game etc,

Gary did not mention not being able to save games with this player, he mentions not being able to interact with them. Which you cannot with this player.

Sorry that garden didn't like the offering

You mentioned earlier that the "Garden is mainly about Games". It's not. Its about abandoned Macintosh games and application software. The DVD game you had attached to the Player's page also did not fall into that category (there are probably others that aren't suited to here, too, and we do remove them if detected). It could not be played as a game by using that player and it was not a standalone Mac game.

I forgot OS9 couldn't even load a TS (title set) folder from finder, without converting to virtual disc like you did. It felt like previous posts in this thread had recommended play-from-hdd in generic sense.

The 1st post I had made in this thread, recommends using .iso images of DVD movies, if zeros' had enough disc space available on his G3 iMac.

Getting back to zeros' and his issue of finding a solution to playing DVD movies on his OS 9x G3 iMac with broken CD/DVD hardware. I cannot see any issue to prevent zeros from video playback of image copies of DVD movies on that rig, if he has enough space for them. His suspect USB DVD player OTOH will be a headache and he should forget it - iso image playback would be a lot smoother anyway.

SkyCapt's picture
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Joined: 2017 Jan 11

Forgive my momentary communications sloppiness. What started as a short msg addressed to G turned into a ramble where I'm replying to you and him, not one, and I know the main subject is the OS9 DVD Player but the talk venturing into DVD Players generalized didn't feel like a hijack/derail to me. My habit is to specify OS9 often when it applies, then when I see written "the DVD Player" it feels like being not necessarily only about "the OS9 DVD Player" but has other possibilities. Didn't the OP query into "another DVD player" so it feels like from the start this topic wasn't just about the one v2.7 Player.

Garden is mainly about Games vs. not : my words came largely from Garden's own "About" tab at top right, this came up in another thread recently when it was mentioned this sort of mission-statement garden has been showing centers on games and doesn't mention apps. I'm for not giving apps a back-burner; perhaps the About text is outdated.

I'll have to swap my AGP cards soon, just to try the sinbad game in OS9. Working/not working, either way is something I have to see now. Rambling about these topics is how these ideas happen, looking on the bright side.

If the G3 iMac has FireWire, an external drive built from an internal-drive put in a sled having a FireWire interface can read fast enough for DVD. Otherwise, DVD playback can require About 2 MB/sec and OS9's USB is limited to v1 = 1.5 MB/sec minus some 'overhead' so yup USB won't play decent and probably the OS9 player won't make the effort to look for any USB playback devices, but maybe FireWire?

MikeTomTom's picture
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Garden is mainly about Games vs. not : my words came largely from Garden's own "About" tab at top right

I hadn't looked at that page since I don't know how long... it's now updated to better reflect our mission. Thanks for the heads-up.

SkyCapt's picture
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This is the happiest place on the web.

Deinterlacing. When last I used OS9 DVD Player, I noted it does zero types of deinterlacing the video, which is a big problem at least here in 'region one' where im at. OS9 Player was built to look alright on CRT televisions, by utilitizing "motion interlacing" for framerate convertions, but when multimegapixel flat TVs became prolific (coincidentally not long after Apple stopped OS9 development) then it was mass-realized the motion-interlacing could not stay, it's awful looking without an old vga-based crt. It won't be noticed on 24 fps professionally made movies, but on indie films or box sets of TV series, motion interlacing happens a lot. Many other films that seem 24 fps from start to finish can have little segments of 30 fps tucked inside, this can come from digital content-editing that had been done just ahead of disc publishing. When motion interlacing takes place for only a few seconds inside a full feature, it was commonly called a bug - "the chroma bug".