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SkyCapt's picture
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Joined: 2017 Jan 11
Can I run Classic Environment on a PowerPC with Tiger Server Universal Binary edition?

(yes I can) - I have plenty of OS 9.2.x "System Folder" ready, but
I get no "Classic" prefpane and trying to launch a Classic app generates an "unexpected error code -1".

Apple removed Classic from this flavor of OSX because of Server Security concerns and also for the intel-friendly capability
of this version of Tiger (no Intel build has Classic mode). I can tweak the OS a little, using files from Tiger Client/Server PPC.
If Classic removal was permanent it'd probably say a friendly msg like "No Classic" instead of "error code -1".

I only now tested out the PPC version of Tiger Server, and found :

Tiger Server PPC comes with Classic, doesn't have The Nastiest of Crashes in 10.4.9 thru 10.4.11 like Client PPC does, and doesn't have broken ATIRadeon9700 graphics card drivers in 10.4.9 thru 10.4.10 like Server Universal does, SO, it'd be best just to operate Tiger Server PPC rather than Tiger Server Universal. The PPC-only edition of OSX is smaller, faster, and executes more securely and efficiently. The Universal edition can be shuttled between various hardware having mixed blend of CPU architecture, that's its advantage.

Regardless, here is how to add Classic mode to Tiger Server Universal
(see next msg)

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SkyCapt's picture
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Joined: 2017 Jan 11

Classic Environment is made of two (2) software packages:
/System/Library/PreferencePanes/Classic.prefPane
/System/Library/CoreServices/Classic Startup.app

For putting Classic mode into Server Universal, get these files from out of any post-installed Tiger OSX PPC 10.4.7 thru 10.4.11 client or server, they're ALL the same version ( Classic.prefPane v1.1 and Classic Startup.app v1.9 ). You can copy in both "files" (they're packages really) using Finder, this requires you to "Authenticate" the copy operations because they modify the System. Now both files won't work yet, due to file permissions, and what's more, the "Classic Startup.app" has a resource in it which requires "special permission". The copy operation via Finder says "One or more items have special permissions and cannot be copied. Do you want to skip them? Stop/Continue", press Continue. Now run the Terminal.

(this assumes you are booted in the volume you're trying to modify)
ls -l /System/Library/PreferencePanes
... reveals that the file Classic.prefPane which you just copied doesn't have matching ownership, all files are root:wheel except the new one. The Classic Startup.app has the same problem. Fix this with ...

sudo chown -R root:wheel /System/Library/PreferencePanes/Classic.prefPane
sudo chown -R root:wheel "/System/Library/CoreServices/Classic Startup.app"

... if you list the files again (ls -l ...) now you'll see the ownership matches correctly. On to the special permission, "TruBlueEnvironment" requires code # 4755 ...

sudo chmod 4755 "/System/Library/CoreServices/Classic Startup.app/Contents/Resources/TruBlueEnvironment"

That's all, and you shouldn't need rebooting. Open "System Preferences" now, and "Classic" should appear with "System". For some reason Server doesn't present the option to add Classic control in the Menu bar, not even the official PPC version does. Sad

Make a "System Folder" and begin running Classic apps. One more thing, I've already tried adding Tiger Classic to Leopard : its a no go.

bertyboy's picture
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Joined: 2009 Jun 14

I suppose the other easy way would be to install Tiger client with all the Classic bits, then install Tiger Server on top of it (it becomes an "upgrade"). Does that work ?

SkyCapt's picture
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Joined: 2017 Jan 11

I haven't tried, probably not, because the client and the server versions are too different. For example 10.4.8 is the first client version to allow Screen Zoom using the mouse Wheel while holding down the Control key, but on Server Universal, 10.4.7 is allowing this. Apple presented different update packages including security updates, whether for client or for server.

And if that did work, then it would Fragment the heck out of the boot volume if not an ssd.

Thoughts:
Mac OSX Server is a lot like "Mac OSX Pro", like how QuickTime is supplied with an OS and you can upgrade to QuickTime Pro, the client version of OSX is what comes with new computers, and it can be upgraded to "Pro" (server), just because it's named Server doesn't mean we have to use and learn all the Server features.

Server has many differences, mainly security related, like built in anti-virus, no automatic login, etc.

The install disc won't let me install to an already empty volume, maybe it checks the date of the volume since we're using a reg code from yr 2005, but it does install after I use the installer's disk utility to freshly erase a volume. Seems like it won't allow the Server version to be laid down on top of a client version, again maybe for security.

bertyboy's picture
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Joined: 2009 Jun 14

May be a Tiger / Leopard / Snow Leopard thing.

In Jaguar and Panther, this was definitely a possibility. I would upgrade the Client version to match the Server install version, "upgrade" with the server, and then apply the Combo upgrade for Server to the latest patch level.
You could probably also apply the Server Combo patch to resolve any differences between client and server installed versions if you didn't try to match them before installing Server.
Of course, we're back to this model with Lion and later, install Client then buy and upgrade Server on top of it.

SkyCapt's picture
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Joined: 2017 Jan 11

Right, Tiger is not behaving that way. I'm in 10.4.11 Server PPC, and if I try the 10.4.11 Server PPC Combo Update,
I'm allowed to install it on 10.4.11 Server PPC (atop itself) but I'm blocked from updating 10.4.8 Client PPC. If I try the 10.4.11 Server Universal Combo, I'm blocked from both - it won't let me update 10.4.11 PPC into 10 4.11 Universal.

Speaking of which, I grabbed the updaters from apple and while the Tiger Universal and Client ones seem normal,
all Tiger Server PPC updaters 10.4.4 thru 10.4.11 (Combo and Delta) have a hidden file named ".discCookie" and the update .pkg cannot be run outside the .dmg , the .pkg ain't even .pkg but .mpkg instead, so the .mpkg wants to see the "Cookie" file. wtf?

And last I knew, 2009-005 was the final Security Update for Tiger, but now apple offers "2009-006" even though it was not made in 2009. There is a client 2009-006 and a server 2009-006, no longer PPC vs. Intel, so I guess this means 2009-006 is Universal even tho it doesn't specify. The Client 2009-006 .pkg was made 2012 Mar 13 while the Server 2009-006 .pkg was made or last updated 2014 Nov 6. **Oops, now i see 2009-006 is for Leopard-only and not Tiger, their download pages must've been ambiguous and why 2012/2014? I'll probably never use this update, apple turned to the dark side with Leopard imo - and Lion was an acronym for "Like It Or Not". The name Leopard even hints at that idiom: "a Leopard cannot change its spots" whereas apple changed like 180'.

SkyCapt's picture
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Joined: 2017 Jan 11

For some reason Server doesn't present the option to add Classic control in the Menu bar, not even the official PPC version does.

Classic control CAN be returned to the Menu bar, probably by using a "defaults write" command in Terminal. I've got it in my Menu bar now, but I got it there using an unrelated hack which makes a side effect of smashing a large set of System Preferences settings. I don't have the specific Terminal command, just saying it can be done. My hack is to simultaneously disable FireWire, Ethernet, and USB-1 for a big speed increase on MDD2003. After doing so, the option to add Classic control to the Menu bar reappears when running Classic prefPane.

stratusfear's picture
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Joined: 2017 Jun 27

Copying /System/Library/CoreServices/Menu Extras/Classic.menu from a Tiger PPC installation and making sure the user:group ownership is root:wheel, then the option to have the control in the menu bar appears and does indeed work without any other trickery, at least on my 1GHz TiBook.